[AR] Injector Customs
- From: Bill Claybaugh <wclaybaugh2@xxxxxxxxxx>
- To: "arocket@xxxxxxxxxxxxx" <arocket@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Wed, 13 Nov 2013 08:47:44 -0500
Company X uses Pintles because they are the lowest cost injectors; Tom's
history is not coincidental, but a company with a singular focus on cost would
have switched to another design if it were lower cost.
Parts count matters....
Bill
Sent from my iPhone
On Nov 12, 2013, at 18:51, Ben Brockert <wikkit@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> SpaceX use pintles because head of propulsion Tom Mueller came from
> TRW. TRW was responsible for the LEMDE and did most of the early R&D
> work on the pintle injector, and still has proprietary data that
> hasn't been replicated. Masten Space uses pintles because Jon Goff got
> infected with the pintle meme somewhere along the way. I tend to use
> them on my projects as well. The only other group that does much with
> them is Gary Hudson's various projects like Air Launch.
>
> It's still definitely a niche injector even in the US. The primary
> advantage is simplicity and innate stability over a large throttle
> range, not necessarily C* efficiency. Though it's not bad either. They
> also have higher bandwidth (thrust wrt time) than most other
> injectors.
>
> Back to the nozzle thing, it sounds like Mr. Glass might have been
> misled, and the Soviet Union just used simple nozzles. It had been my
> impression that their high performance engines were more attributed to
> high performance cycles than unusual nozzle performance.
>
> Ben
>
> On Tue, Nov 12, 2013 at 4:29 PM, Alexander Mikhailov <avmich@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>> As I understand, single component injectors are more popular in USA, and
>> comparatively double component injectors - in Russian engines.
>>
>> SpaceX's Merlin uses pintles.
>>
>> A very interesting case is F-1 where the main task was to avoid
>> oscillations, not improve combustion, and the injector pattern was
>> essential...
>>
>>
>> On Tuesday, November 12, 2013 3:24 PM, George Herbert
>> <george.herbert@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Nov 12, 2013 at 2:51 PM, Alexander Mikhailov <avmich@xxxxxxxxx>
>> wrote:
>>
>> ....
>> And one more thing - it's strange to hear that US, with the tradition
>> of using pintle injectors, have more optimal combustion process, while
>> Russian injectors commonly have many much smaller injectors, matched
>> by flow. Pintle should have other advantages, I guess...
>>
>>
>> The US pintle engines were mostly involved with the Lunar Module descent
>> engine (LMDE) and its derivatives (which ended up in the TR201 which was
>> classic Delta's second stage engine),
>>
>> Nearly all flown US engines are classic injectors.
>>
>>
>> --
>> -george william herbert
>> george.herbert@xxxxxxxxx
>>
>>
>
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