[AR] Re: NASA test of quantum vacuum plasma thruster (was "Anyone heardof...
- From: "" <dmarc-noreply@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> (Redacted sender "JMKrell@xxxxxxx" for DMARC)
- To: arocket@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
- Date: Mon, 4 Aug 2014 13:59:54 -0400 (EDT)
Thanks, Ian for putting some numbers to this question. I also noticed the
poor efficiency of these quantum drives in my quick scan of the papers,
which makes them impractical for propulsion unless your frame of reference is
at a vehicle velocity >200 Km/s.
Today’s Ion and HALL thruster technologies offer practical solutions for
our current space mission requirements of a manned Mars mission. A $100K
Kickstarter fund would be better utilized to improve our current technologies.
John Krell
In a message dated 8/4/2014 10:44:33 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time,
rsteinke@xxxxxxxxxxx writes:
On Mon, 4 Aug 2014 17:47:06 +0100
Ian Woollard <ian.woollard@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> On 4 August 2014 16:54, Peter Fairbrother <zenadsl6186@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>
>> Suppose, as has been claimed, the drive is somehow exchanging momentum
>> with the entire universe. The momentum of the universe may have a
(?local)
>> velocity - which would be mathematically equivalent to a preferred
frame of
>> reference.
>>
>> If so, there need be no violation of either of the conservation laws.
>>
>
> Even that wouldn't be of any practical use for propulsion.
>
> There's basically zero chance that you would moving close the preferred
> frame of reference's speed. And if you're not.. .big trouble in little
> china.
If the preferred frame of reference was going in the direction you want to
go
it would be useful for propulsion.
On Mon, 4 Aug 2014 10:17:44 -0700
Pierce Nichols <piercenichols@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>
> Let's take, for example, the NASA tests. I haven't had time to read the
> paper in depth (thank you Clive), but at a skim, it appears that they are
> claiming a thrust to power ratio of 2 uN/W. The required upward velocity
to
> violate energy conservation is 500 km/s. That's infeasible for
engineering
> reasons... but it's not relativistic by any stretch of the imagination.
>
> -p
You are assuming the thrust to power ratio is constant. If instead it
depends
on your speed relative to the preferred frame of reference that you are
pushing against then it doesn't have to violate conservation of energy.
Once
you get up to 500 km/s you will find that you are no longer getting 2
uN/W.
The NASA tests, if they aren't experimental error, only show a thrust to
power ratio under one particular experimental condition.
Disclaimer: I also think it's probably experimental error, but if a couple
different groups have seen something unusual then someone like NIAC should
look into it.
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