[access-uk] Re: Time to do the Apple Switch? Leopard's New VoiceOver features
- From: "Ray's Home" <rays-home@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- To: <access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2007 13:35:29 -0000
Very practical issues you bring up here Jackie.
Mind you, I had thought that swapping files between Macs and PCs
wasn't all that problematic these days; or have I been reading the
Apple Hype too much?
I'm fairly sure you can exchange between .wav and .AIFF in the audio
field.
This does of course get us away from access issues in the context of
this list, but its a consideration nonetheless if you are
contemplating buying a Mac.
From Ray
I can be contacted off-list at:
mailto:ray-48@xxxxxxxx
-----Original Message-----
Jackie Cairns
Ray, I agree with you. The DTP software they all used at college was
Quark,
but even the PC equivalent was a dead loss to me. But I had some
lovely
folk who helped me out with a few great work-arounds, and coupled with
my
obsessive determination to get my HND, I cracked it, Mac or no Mac,
DTP
software or no DTP software.
I believe the story behind why they went for Macs in the first place
is that
they bought some in bulk cheaper than they could get the same specs on
a PC.
But the students argued that if they worked on the newspaper or
assignments
within the newsroom confines using a Mac, they couldn't then go home
and
open the same documents using their PC. This was where I had sympathy
for
them, because I never had that difficulty.
In the end, I was lucky in that I worked alongside a young bunch of
fully
sighted students who helped me out sometimes, and who I could help out
too.
I think it was the happiest three years I ever spent doing anything
(smile.)
Jackie
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ray's Home" <rays-home@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
To: <access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Monday, October 29, 2007 1:07 PM
Subject: [access-uk] Re: Time to do the Apple Switch? Leopard's New
VoiceOver features
> Very interesting experiences you've related there Jackie.
>
> Having met a few media types I know all too well how committed they
> are to Macs. (that's putting it politely though. there's a very
> exclusive club you have to belong to in those circles to prove your
> validity or even virility, (LOL).
>
> To get one thing out of the way though, Apples under OS X do seem to
> be very stable and don't appear to throw too many woblies. The
> integration of hardware and software is far more under control with
> Macs than it has ever been with the traditionally open architecture
of
> the PC.
>
> If you pay enough for a well put together PC though, the stability
> issues can be near negligible. (You'll be spending as much as you
> would on a Mac going for such a machine, but many are made,
especially
> for audio and video work.) Still, a further problem Windows faces
is
> poorly behaved software, and MS itself is too often guilty of this.
>
> Desktop publishing is no longer the exclusive domain of the Mac and
> hasn't been for a long time, in spite of the pretensions of media
> folk. Not only that, but you can get very respectable free DTP
> software for the PC which no one but an out and out snob would
dismiss
> out of hand.
>
> DTP though has never been an area where VI people could hope to have
> proper access as by its nature it is unavoidably graphical in what
it
> does and the way it does it. The most important thing, I would have
> said, is being able to contribute properly to publications that are
> going to be used in a layout program. No doubt smaller outfits do
> depend on individuals knowing the DTP business, but in larger
> structured business, I'd have thought division of labour in this
area
> is what happens.
>
> From Ray
> I can be contacted off-list at:
> mailto:ray-48@xxxxxxxx
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> Jackie Cairns
>
>
> Because of doing my course at the time, and the fact everybody kept
> telling
> me that DTP was much better on a Mac, we got a shot of a Mac to play
> with at
> home with what I can only describe as terrible speech software. Oh
> boy was
> it not half a steep learning curve!! (big smile.)
>
> I was lucky in that my programme tutor was a great guy with a lot of
> patience, and sometimes he'd speak me through some things on the Mac
> in the
> newsroom, just so I could try to understand the concept of what the
> others
> were doing. And some publishers gave me books in Mac format that I
> needed
> to access, which was a sort of incentive to get me to try to learn
it.
> But
> I just couldn't get to grips with it, and I had so much stuff to do
> anyway
> with running the college newspaper and my own assignments that I
> couldn't
> devote the time it required.
>
> Interestingly, after my tutor left, and I finished my course, I
heard
> the
> college went over to PC full-time because nobody liked using the
Mac,
> despite its ability to be better for DTP and more reliable with its
> OS.
>
> Jackie
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "ari" <aridamoulakis@xxxxxxxxx>
> To: <access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> Sent: Monday, October 29, 2007 12:09 PM
> Subject: [access-uk] Re: Time to do the Apple Switch? Leopard's New
> VoiceOver features
>
>
>> I'd heard of the whole Mac thing when I needed to get my laptop for
> Uni a
>> few months ago, but I was totally disappointed, because I went to
> the MAC
>> shop to try and look at Voiceover, and there was obviously noone
> there who
>> knew how it worked, my brother started it up for me, but we just
> didn't
>> know how to access help and stuff properly. I probably could have
> tried
>> harder, but the things that worry me about Voiceover are that you
> just
>> never know if it will always be updated properly or frequently,
> although
>> it's a great idea, you never know if Apple will just oneday not
keep
> it up
>> to speed. Also, when I was looking round on the Internet for VO
> resources,
>> I did find a tutorial, but the main support is through a user
group,
>> correct me if I'm wrong here, but I don't even know how many
people,
> or,
>> if there are any blind people working at Apple on VO? There is no
> address
>> at Apple to which anyone can write if they have problems. With
newer
> web
>> technologies and stuff coming out, you just hope that you're using
>> software that the people who're developing do care about making it
> work
>> with such things. Itunes does work with VO, and apparrently Safari
> and
>> most things as well, but apparrently mac users need to go through
> millions
>> of keystrokes? I then decided that, considering the really high
> price of a
>> mac laptop, and the fact that I did have JAWS, I'd just buy a cheap
> normal
>> laptop instead. The Mac thing does have very positive stuff
though,
> in
>> that you can just walk to any mac and use it without having to
worry
> about
>> anything. Wish MS would make a propper Windows screenreader like
> Apple,
>> but then the whole argument of what happens if screenreader
> companies go
>> out of business and MS doesn't keep the reader uptodate would again
> be a
>> problem.
>> Ari
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Jackie Cairns" <cairnsplace@xxxxxxx>
>> To: <access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>> Sent: Monday, October 29, 2007 1:44 PM
>> Subject: [access-uk] Re: Time to do the Apple Switch? Leopard's New
>> VoiceOver features
>>
>>
>>> If only this had been possible four or five years ago when I was
> doing
>>> journalism at college. The newsroom was full of Macs and the one
> PC with
>>> Windows 98 that I used to monopolise. Interestingly, all the
> students
>>> used to jump in my seat the minute I moved so they could use the
PC
>>> instead of their Macs because they hated them, and they were all
> fully
>>> sighted. I think they all used a PC at home and just couldn't get
> to
>>> grips with the Mac. So this big queue would form to get on my
> machine,
>>> and I couldn't venture anywhere without someone literally
> hot-footing it
>>> to my desk. All good fun.
>>>
>>> Jackie
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> From: "Graham Page" <gpage@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>> To: <access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>> Sent: Monday, October 29, 2007 11:34 AM
>>> Subject: [access-uk] Re: Time to do the Apple Switch? Leopard's
New
>>> VoiceOver features
>>>
>>>
>>>> well Gordon it will be interesting to see how you go with this
and
> to
>>>> see
>>>> how others go as well. I would not be surprised to find more
info
>>>> appearing
>>>> on ACB Radio's Main Menu or blindcooltec at some point when those
> with
>>>> some
>>>> experience of the mac get hands on it. Altimately we will see
> whether
>>>> the
>>>> hype reflects the real situation and whether once again, the Mac
> can be
>>>> described as anything like accessible and how far this
> accessibility
>>>> goes.
>>>>
>>>> Regards
>>>>
>>>> Graham
>>>> Graham Page
>>>> Home Phone: 0207 265 9493
>>>> Mobile: 07753 607980
>>>> Fax: 0870 706 2773
>>>> Email: gpage@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>> MSN: gabriel_mcbird@xxxxxxxxxxx
>>>> Skype: gabriel_mcbird
>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>> From: "Gordon Keen" <gordon.keen@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>>> To: <access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>>> Sent: Monday, October 29, 2007 11:16 AM
>>>> Subject: [access-uk] Re: Time to do the Apple Switch? Leopard's
> New
>>>> VoiceOver features
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Hi Ray
>>>> I can confirm that the mac-book works very happily as a dual boot
>>>> machine
>>>> and I have been running it for about three or four months using
> hal as
>>>> the
>>>> screen reader.
>>>> Next week end I shall be upgrading to leopard and weaning myself
> off the
>>>> dreaded microsludge.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Regards
>>>> Gordon
>>>> From glorious Devon, England
>>>>
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On
> Behalf
>>>> Of
>>>> Ray's Home
>>>> Sent: 29 October 2007 10:44
>>>> To: Access-Uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>> Subject: [access-uk] Time to do the Apple Switch? Leopard's New
>>>> VoiceOver
>>>> features
>>>>
>>>> Hope you find this interesting, as I do. A few comments after
> news of
>>>> Leopard's new Voice Over features.
>>>>
>>>> VoiceOver info.
>>>>
>>>> Universal Access
>>>>
>>>> Alex - A New Voice Give yourself a new voice. Meet Alex - a new
>>>> English male voice that uses advanced,
>>>> patented Apple technologies to deliver natural breathing and
>>>> intonation, even at
>>>> fast speaking rates.
>>>>
>>>> Plug-and-Play Refreshable Braille Display Support Quickly set up
>>>> popular, refreshable Braille displays. VoiceOver detects and
>>>> configures
>>>> as soon as you plug them in. No additional software or setup is
>>>> required.
>>>>
>>>> Braille Output During OS Installation For the first time ever on
a
>>>> desktop computer, you can use a Braille display while
>>>> installing or upgrading your operating system.
>>>>
>>>> The Braille Panel See a virtual Braille display - a visual
>>>> representation of VoiceOver Braille output
>>>> onscreen along with an English text translation.
>>>>
>>>> Customisable Braille Display Input Keys Customise a Braille
> display
>>>> more easily than ever before. Just choose a VoiceOver
>>>> command, then press and hold the input keys. A tone sounds to let
> you
>>>> know the command has been assigned successfully.
>>>>
>>>> Contracted and Non-Contracted Braille Output Braille in standard
>>>> contracted format or non-contracted "computer Braille".
>>>> VoiceOver automatically converts contracted Braille under the
> cursor
>>>> so it's easier
>>>> to edit, then contracts it again when the cursor moves.
>>>>
>>>> NumPad Commander Control VoiceOver using only the numeric keypad
> just
>>>> like JAWS and Windows-Eyes.
>>>> This makes it easier for screen reader users to switch from a PC
> to a
>>>> Mac and provides easy access to your favourite VoiceOver
commands.
>>>>
>>>> Portable VoiceOver Preferences Instantly reconfigure your
> VoiceOver
>>>> preferences. Just plug in a flash drive containing
>>>> your preferences and Leopard instantly reconfigures to work and
> act
>>>> just like your Mac - without leaving a trace when you leave.
>>>>
>>>> Faster Web and Page Navigation Quickly navigate long documents or
> web
>>>> pages. Jump to key elements like headers,
>>>> tables and links and by text attributes like underlining, bold,
>>>> italics and colour - even text phrases.
>>>>
>>>> Hot Spots Monitor up to ten different areas onscreen and be
> alerted
>>>> when there's a change.
>>>> Then jump directly to any hot spot to investigate or take action.
>>>>
>>>> Drag-and-Drop Support Use drag-and-drop actions by keyboard only,
> in
>>>> accessible applications.
>>>>
>>>> Integrated Interactive Tutorial Learn VoiceOver unassisted in a
> safe
>>>> environment. A built-in tutorial lets you practice
>>>> as you learn.
>>>>
>>>> Misspelled Word Detection Hear when a word is misspelled while
> reading
>>>> text. Choose a tone or a spoken description.
>>>> Positional Audio Effects Benefit from many new sound effects in
>>>> VoiceOver. Audio cues provide an improved
>>>> sense of location.
>>>>
>>>> Highlight by Word or Sentence Set the VoiceOver cursor to
> highlight
>>>> each word or sentence being read as it is spoken.
>>>>
>>>> New VoiceOver Utility Customise VoiceOver more easily. A new
> VoiceOver
>>>> Utility layout includes many new
>>>> options and preferences for customising VoiceOver.
>>>>
>>>> Improved Application Accessibility Do more with VoiceOver.
Bundled
>>>> Leopard applications and utilities have been enhanced
>>>> for improved accessibility.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> (Ray back again)
>>>> I'm thinking now seriously of doing the switch, and possibly
going
> for
>>>> a dual boot equiped Apple, so not leaving Windows behind
entirely.
>>>> This seems to work better than many might think it does.
>>>>
>>>> Given Vista's fearsome reputation so far, and some prety
draconian
>>>> measures around DRM to boot, I wonder seriously if the Apple
> shouldn't
>>>> be given a serious look. Not that I know for certain the Apple
> will
>>>> be imune from the media industry's inroads on what we can do.
> (No,
>>>> I'm not an ilegal sharer or anything, but I do use my PC for a
lot
> of
>>>> audio work these days.)
>>>>
>>>> Those thoughts apart, hope the above was of interest.
>>>>
>>>> Cheers,,
>>>> From Ray
>>>> I can be contacted off-list at:
>>>> mailto:ray-48@xxxxxxxx
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