Gradatim Ferociter.
...trying to figure out where ferociousness fits into the Blue picture.
The step by step part, fits, and as Henry pointed out, this is a useful
step to testy ground support equipment.
If you are still engineering with 20th century development tools.
If you were engineering with 21st century tools, you would know when you
designed the carriers erectors etc. that they would fit and manage the
loads, and there would not be much risk in using a real flight article for
the first real fitting. And you would be ready for first flight a decade
sooner.... But that would require flight ready engines which seem to be an
issue for blue as well. And a second stage in a similar state of readiness.
How do you say "at a snails pace" in Latin?
Per Escargoum?
On Wed, Nov 10, 2021, 8:05 PM FreeLists Mailing List Manager <
ecartis@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
arocket Digest Wed, 10 Nov 2021 Volume: 09 Issue: 245
In This Issue:
[AR] Re: new Glenn mockup
[AR] Re: new Glenn mockup
[AR] Re: New Glen mock-up.
[AR] Re: New Glen mock-up.
[AR] Re: New Glen mock-up.
[AR] Re: New Glen mock-up.
[AR] Re: New Glen mock-up.
[AR] Re: New Glen mock-up.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
From: James Fackert <jimfackert@xxxxxxxxx>
Date: Tue, 9 Nov 2021 21:53:17 -0500
Subject: [AR] Re: new Glenn mockup
Pretty massively huge empty shell of the first stage only...
Progress, though!
On Tue, Nov 9, 2021, 8:05 PM FreeLists Mailing List Manager <
ecartis@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
arocket Digest Tue, 09 Nov 2021 Volume: 09 Issue: 244https://www.geekwire.com/2021/blue-origin-practices-dummy-version-new-glenn-orbital-rocket-florida/
In This Issue:
[AR] New Glen mock-up.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Anthony Cesaroni <anthony@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [AR] New Glen mock-up.
Date: Tue, 9 Nov 2021 02:53:41 +0000
Anthony J. Cesaroni
President/CEO
Cesaroni Technology/Cesaroni Aerospace
http://www.cesaronitech.com/
(941) 360-3100 x1004 Sarasota
(905) 887-2370 x222 Toronto
------------------------------
End of arocket Digest V9 #244
*****************************
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 10 Nov 2021 05:51:50 -0500
From: Ed Kelleher <Pres@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [AR] Re: new Glenn mockup
Sidetrack
At 09:53 PM 11/9/2021, you wrote:
Pretty massively huge empty shell of the first stage only...ecartis@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>ecartis@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
Progress, though!
On Tue, Nov 9, 2021, 8:05 PM FreeLists Mailing List Manager <<mailto:
arocket Digest Tue, 09 Nov 2021    Volume: 09 Issue: 244https://www.geekwire.com/2021/blue-origin-practices-dummy-version-new-glenn-orbital-rocket-florida/
In This Issue:
        [AR] New Glen mock-up.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Anthony Cesaroni <<mailto:anthony@xxxxxxxxxxx>anthony@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [AR] New Glen mock-up.
Date: Tue, 9 Nov 2021 02:53:41 +0000
<
https://www.geekwire.com/2021/blue-origin-practices-dummy-version-new-glenn-orbital-rocket-florida/
Anthony J. Cesaroni
President/CEO
Cesaroni Technology/Cesaroni Aerospace
<http://www.cesaronitech.com/>http://www.cesaronitech.com/
(941) 360-3100 x1004 Sarasota
(905) 887-2370 x222 Toronto
------------------------------
End of arocket Digest V9 #244
*****************************
------------------------------
From: roxanna Mason <rocketmaster.ken@xxxxxxxxx>
Date: Wed, 10 Nov 2021 03:45:43 -0800
Subject: [AR] Re: New Glen mock-up.
It's a moral booster not rocket,
Otherwise a waste of money,
Ken
On Mon, Nov 8, 2021 at 6:53 PM Anthony Cesaroni <anthony@xxxxxxxxxxx>
wrote:
https://www.geekwire.com/2021/blue-origin-practices-dummy-version-new-glenn-orbital-rocket-florida/
Anthony J. Cesaroni
President/CEO
Cesaroni Technology/Cesaroni Aerospace
http://www.cesaronitech.com/
(941) 360-3100 x1004 Sarasota
(905) 887-2370 x222 Toronto
------------------------------
Subject: [AR] Re: New Glen mock-up.
From: Henry Vanderbilt <hvanderbilt@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Date: Wed, 10 Nov 2021 09:15:16 -0700
I haven't been following New Glenn closely - I've had distractions - but
it seems obvious to me that IF this "dummy version" was built using some
of the same manufacturing processes and tooling as the flight vehicle -
I'd guess so from the photo but don't know - it's a very useful workup
for the production team, a chance to practice and get up to speed on
building the main structures where minor mistakes are not critical and
easily corrected.
And if as seems very likely it has been built to the same dimensions and
specs as the flight first stage (and presumably had mass added to
accurately simulate the missing bits, engines, tanks etc) then it's also
a very useful workout/debugger tool for the (necessarily substantial)
ground handling arrangements for the flight boosters, again with much
less worry about making and correcting minor mistakes.
IOW, they only have to learn to avoid ONE flight-booster destroying
error with this test piece for it to more than pay for itself. Not so?
Henry
On 11/10/2021 4:45 AM, roxanna Mason wrote:
It's a moral booster not rocket,https://www.geekwire.com/2021/blue-origin-practices-dummy-version-new-glenn-orbital-rocket-florida/
Otherwise a waste of money,
Ken
On Mon, Nov 8, 2021 at 6:53 PM Anthony Cesaroni <anthony@xxxxxxxxxxx
<mailto:anthony@xxxxxxxxxxx>> wrote:
<https://www.geekwire.com/2021/blue-origin-practices-dummy-version-new-glenn-orbital-rocket-florida/
Anthony J. Cesaroni
President/CEO
Cesaroni Technology/Cesaroni Aerospace
http://www.cesaronitech.com/ ;<http://www.cesaronitech.com/>
(941) 360-3100 x1004 Sarasota
(905) 887-2370 x222 Toronto
------------------------------
From: Matthew JL <prmattjl@xxxxxxxxx>
Date: Wed, 10 Nov 2021 11:57:11 -0500
Subject: [AR] Re: New Glen mock-up.
Structural outer mold line pathfinders have been the norm since Saturn.
Important for testing pad fitment, transportation procedures, tooling,
etc. I don’t get why this is catching flack.
Best,
-Matt L.
On Wed, Nov 10, 2021 at 11:15 AM Henry Vanderbilt <
hvanderbilt@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
I haven't been following New Glenn closely - I've had distractions - butof
it seems obvious to me that IF this "dummy version" was built using some
the same manufacturing processes and tooling as the flight vehicle - I'dthe
guess so from the photo but don't know - it's a very useful workup for
production team, a chance to practice and get up to speed on building thecorrected.
main structures where minor mistakes are not critical and easily
a
And if as seems very likely it has been built to the same dimensions and
specs as the flight first stage (and presumably had mass added to
accurately simulate the missing bits, engines, tanks etc) then it's also
very useful workout/debugger tool for the (necessarily substantial)ground
handling arrangements for the flight boosters, again with much less worryhttps://www.geekwire.com/2021/blue-origin-practices-dummy-version-new-glenn-orbital-rocket-florida/
about making and correcting minor mistakes.
IOW, they only have to learn to avoid ONE flight-booster destroying error
with this test piece for it to more than pay for itself. Not so?
Henry
On 11/10/2021 4:45 AM, roxanna Mason wrote:
It's a moral booster not rocket,
Otherwise a waste of money,
Ken
On Mon, Nov 8, 2021 at 6:53 PM Anthony Cesaroni <anthony@xxxxxxxxxxx>
wrote:
Anthony J. Cesaroni
President/CEO
Cesaroni Technology/Cesaroni Aerospace
http://www.cesaronitech.com/
(941) 360-3100 x1004 Sarasota
(905) 887-2370 x222 Toronto
------------------------------
From: "J. Cameron Cooper" <jccooper@xxxxxxxxx>
Date: Wed, 10 Nov 2021 11:00:39 -0600
Subject: [AR] Re: New Glen mock-up.
While I believe they have some stuff made with real tooling, this in
particular is a steel boilerplate version made by a local steel fab shop.
It's destined for ground handling tests and practice:
https://twitter.com/blueorigin/status/1457793865100902402?s=20
On Wed, Nov 10, 2021 at 10:15 AM Henry Vanderbilt <
hvanderbilt@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
I haven't been following New Glenn closely - I've had distractions - butof
it seems obvious to me that IF this "dummy version" was built using some
the same manufacturing processes and tooling as the flight vehicle - I'dthe
guess so from the photo but don't know - it's a very useful workup for
production team, a chance to practice and get up to speed on building thecorrected.
main structures where minor mistakes are not critical and easily
a
And if as seems very likely it has been built to the same dimensions and
specs as the flight first stage (and presumably had mass added to
accurately simulate the missing bits, engines, tanks etc) then it's also
very useful workout/debugger tool for the (necessarily substantial)ground
handling arrangements for the flight boosters, again with much less worryhttps://www.geekwire.com/2021/blue-origin-practices-dummy-version-new-glenn-orbital-rocket-florida/
about making and correcting minor mistakes.
IOW, they only have to learn to avoid ONE flight-booster destroying error
with this test piece for it to more than pay for itself. Not so?
Henry
On 11/10/2021 4:45 AM, roxanna Mason wrote:
It's a moral booster not rocket,
Otherwise a waste of money,
Ken
On Mon, Nov 8, 2021 at 6:53 PM Anthony Cesaroni <anthony@xxxxxxxxxxx>
wrote:
Anthony J. Cesaroni
President/CEO
Cesaroni Technology/Cesaroni Aerospace
http://www.cesaronitech.com/
(941) 360-3100 x1004 Sarasota
(905) 887-2370 x222 Toronto
--
J Cameron Cooper
jccooper@xxxxxxxxx
jccooper@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx <anything@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
------------------------------
From: roxanna Mason <rocketmaster.ken@xxxxxxxxx>
Date: Wed, 10 Nov 2021 09:50:53 -0800
Subject: [AR] Re: New Glen mock-up.
It's the term "mock-up" that's the issue. That implies to me it's not made
of or by flight article materials or manufacturing processes.
When Rocketdyne built that F-1 mock up back in the 60's it looked so
cheezy and fake all covered in silver paint over plywood.
Silver painted wood vs Inconel brazed together with Nioro, no comparison.
Ken
On Wed, Nov 10, 2021 at 8:57 AM Matthew JL <prmattjl@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
Structural outer mold line pathfinders have been the norm since Saturn.some of
Important for testing pad fitment, transportation procedures, tooling,
etc. I don’t get why this is catching flack.
Best,
-Matt L.
On Wed, Nov 10, 2021 at 11:15 AM Henry Vanderbilt <
hvanderbilt@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
I haven't been following New Glenn closely - I've had distractions - but
it seems obvious to me that IF this "dummy version" was built using
thethe same manufacturing processes and tooling as the flight vehicle - I'd
guess so from the photo but don't know - it's a very useful workup for
theproduction team, a chance to practice and get up to speed on building
corrected.main structures where minor mistakes are not critical and easily
also a
And if as seems very likely it has been built to the same dimensions and
specs as the flight first stage (and presumably had mass added to
accurately simulate the missing bits, engines, tanks etc) then it's
groundvery useful workout/debugger tool for the (necessarily substantial)
worryhandling arrangements for the flight boosters, again with much less
errorabout making and correcting minor mistakes.
IOW, they only have to learn to avoid ONE flight-booster destroying
https://www.geekwire.com/2021/blue-origin-practices-dummy-version-new-glenn-orbital-rocket-florida/with this test piece for it to more than pay for itself. Not so?
Henry
On 11/10/2021 4:45 AM, roxanna Mason wrote:
It's a moral booster not rocket,
Otherwise a waste of money,
Ken
On Mon, Nov 8, 2021 at 6:53 PM Anthony Cesaroni <anthony@xxxxxxxxxxx>
wrote:
Anthony J. Cesaroni
President/CEO
Cesaroni Technology/Cesaroni Aerospace
http://www.cesaronitech.com/
(941) 360-3100 x1004 Sarasota
(905) 887-2370 x222 Toronto
------------------------------
From: "John Dom" <johndom@xxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [AR] Re: New Glen mock-up.
Date: Wed, 10 Nov 2021 20:09:14 +0100
Interesting: who was paying for the dummy contration launch pictured ? The
conical “missile†shape reminds of the Sprint ABM of the 70-ies:
http://www.nuclearabms.info/Sprint.html
During the nineties centrifugal launching was discussed briefly on AR.
Considered as a principle for space travel taking off from the lunar
surface f.i. or from some asteroid.
Dismissed only because of the bang of it hitting the atmosphere? Still,
the idea requires no propellant when considered as a first stage.
To make it to space or as an IBM, some chemical multi stage propulsion
payload would be still be required. So it was said then.
In those days liear light gas expansion tubes (not guns really) were also
tested for pneumatic launch. Not sufficiently powerful without a few rocket
stages to make it to orbit or ICBM interception.
Only an explosive gas compressor is necessary as most of the decompressed
gas could’ve been re-used after compression. On the lunar surface…
Re-used, not vented.
John
From: arocket-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:arocket-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx]
On Behalf Of J. Cameron Cooper
Sent: woensdag 10 november 2021 18:01
To: arocket@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [AR] Re: New Glen mock-up.
While I believe they have some stuff made with real tooling, this in
particular is a steel boilerplate version made by a local steel fab shop.
It's destined for ground handling tests and practice:
https://twitter.com/blueorigin/status/1457793865100902402?s
On Wed, Nov 10, 2021 at 10:15 AM Henry Vanderbilt <
hvanderbilt@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
I haven't been following New Glenn closely - I've had distractions - but
it seems obvious to me that IF this "dummy version" was built using some of
the same manufacturing processes and tooling as the flight vehicle - I'd
guess so from the photo but don't know - it's a very useful workup for the
production team, a chance to practice and get up to speed on building the
main structures where minor mistakes are not critical and easily corrected.
And if as seems very likely it has been built to the same dimensions and
specs as the flight first stage (and presumably had mass added to
accurately simulate the missing bits, engines, tanks etc) then it's also a
very useful workout/debugger tool for the (necessarily substantial) ground
handling arrangements for the flight boosters, again with much less worry
about making and correcting minor mistakes.
IOW, they only have to learn to avoid ONE flight-booster destroying error
with this test piece for it to more than pay for itself. Not so?
Henry
On 11/10/2021 4:45 AM, roxanna Mason wrote:
It's a moral booster not rocket,
Otherwise a waste of money,
Ken
On Mon, Nov 8, 2021 at 6:53 PM Anthony Cesaroni <anthony@xxxxxxxxxxx>
wrote:
https://www.geekwire.com/2021/blue-origin-practices-dummy-version-new-glenn-orbital-rocket-florida/
Anthony J. Cesaroni
President/CEO
Cesaroni Technology/Cesaroni Aerospace
<http://www.cesaronitech.com/> http://www.cesaronitech.com/
(941) 360-3100 x1004 Sarasota
(905) 887-2370 x222 Toronto
--
J Cameron Cooper
jccooper@xxxxxxxxx
jccooper@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx <mailto:anything@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
------------------------------
End of arocket Digest V9 #245
*****************************