[etni] Re: projects
- From: "sbshai" <sbshai@xxxxxxxxxxx>
- To: "Iris Elish" <granny@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Thu, 16 Dec 2010 22:16:33 +0200
Thanks for your response, Iris. We do this too, and I believe this is the
way the Inspectorate wants it done; however, my concern is mostly about how
you (and other colleagues) grade the projects so that the students get the
proper feedback (i.e., FULL corrections and comments with SPECIFIC
suggestions for improvement) -- which means an ENORMOUS amount of work for
the teacher, usually more than the student has done!
What I meant to convey is that if executed properly, I find that the
projects simply take up too much precious time (even when they're spaced
throughout the year). Despite the best planning, many obstacles to 'clear
sailing' crop up along the way, such as school scheduling that cancels
English lessons, to mention just one example. Here's another: How do you
handle student "emergencies" that prevent them from submitting their work on
time? Keeping track of this can become a daunting task in itself! That
wouldn't be so bad if the students derived measurable benefit from the
experience, but I believe they'd be so much better off if we concentrated
on giving them the basics to build their language skills (along with their
confidence) instead of requesting them to handle something that is
essentially out of their league. It's rather like asking an undergraduate
to write a doctoral dissertation without the proper preparation!
Despite the reports we sometimes read about the value of doing
projects, I have yet to be convinced that they are really worthwhile. There
are so many other activities we could do on a smaller scale that would be
more in line with their abilities and our time. I got this idea quite
accidentally from a few mini research projects my classes have done in
relation to literature or a particular article of interest we happened to be
reading. The students were divided into groups to research different
aspects of a topic and report to each other about their findings. A short
written report was submitted to me. In this way, each student got a chance
to speak and write briefly, so that it wasn't a chore for them (largely
depending on the subject we were investigating). Of course, I guided
them, but it wasn't a question of writing and revising -- sometimes several
times until they get the project done acceptably! I find something like
this to be a much more realistic and intellectually honest endeavor than
the projects can ever be.
I'd very much like to hear what my peers think.
Tzom kal & Shabbat Shalom,
Batya
----- Original Message -----
From: "Iris Elish" <granny@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
To: <sbshai@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Cc: <etni-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Thursday, 16 December, 2010 8:00 AM
Subject: RE: [etni] Re: projects
Shalom
We usually give our 11th graders an umbrella subject or free choice
according to the choice of each teacher at the beginning of the year. The
pupils are given a handout which specifies what they will be doing during
the year. The whole idea of the project for us is that it is done as a
process over the year.
We start with the students' choice. We usually bring it projects done in
previous years by our students to give them an opportunity to see what is
required. They are then asked to choose a topic and outline the chapters of
their projects. This makes them think of what they want to write about. Some
of the teachers also have them do a survey and a creative chapter as well.
After the teachers approve of the students' choice, the students then go on
to do the introduction (why chose, what know, what to learn), then first,
second, third chapters and the conclusion. This is done as a process as the
students are also given dates when they have to hand in each component. It
also allows the teachers time to correct and instruct and the pupils to
correct if necessary each stage. We have found that it works.
All the best,
Iris.
-----Original Message-----
From: etni-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:etni-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf
Of sbshai
Sent: Wednesday, December 15, 2010 1:55 PM
To: etni@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [etni] Re: projects
Pirchy's question about projects has motivated me to ask for a discussion on
the issue among our colleagues in ETNIland:
Irgun sanctions notwithstanding (first of all, not everyone is an Irgun
member!), it seems to me that most teachers are doing some sort of project
with their students -- which includes assisting the students and grading
their work -- since the mark for the project is supposed to be considered
towards the tziuneh shnati grades. (The question of the validity of these
grades, the lack of standardization, etc. is another story.)
For me, as for most of the teachers on the staff where I work, it's
important that the students be prepared for their oral exam with the
required project. It's also important that we know they have done the
project themselves rather than "borrowed" or inherited it from an anonymous
benefactor! Therefore, we usually assign an umbrella topic with specific
requirements (I have been asking for literature related projects for several
years), but after that, teachers interpret their responsibilities vis a vis
the projects in disparate ways.
Speaking for myself, I must say that the time spent on the projects could be
much more productively be spent elsewhere, but perhaps that's because I tend
to overdo. Still, I see no point in asking students to write a research
project if I'm not ready to provide full corrections and comments to help
them revise and present the best possible project according to their
capabilities. It's therefore quite discouraging that there's essentially no
recognition for the incredible amount of work I do. (The MOE apparently
considers this all in a day's work, students who appreciate extensive
comments are "few and far between", their parents usually only care about
the final mark, and the administration wants satisfied students -- which
simply translates into an easily earned high grade. No one seems to really
care that this should be a learning experience!)
Most teachers do not have this problem to the same extent I do, and I have
given up on expecting anyone to listen to whatever concerns or objections we
may have (certainly not following on the heels of the HOTS controversy).
So if anyone has pointers on how to make projects a worthwhile experience
without becoming personally overwhelmed, I'd welcome the input -- as I'm
sure others would too.
With thanks for your attention,
Batya
---- Original Message -----
From: "פירחי" <dayanm@xxxxxxxxxx>
To: <etni@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Wednesday, 15 December, 2010 10:35 AM
Subject: [etni] projects
> It's this time of year again! I would like to know what is being done
> about projects now? As far as I know, there has been a compromise only
> regarding HOTS, but the sanctions are still on as far as the projects are
> concerned.
> 1. Do your students work on projects?
> 2. Do you help them in the process?
> 3. Do you grade the projects in order to make sure they can be tested on
> them orally?
> Thanks for your help,
> Pirchy Dayan
>
>
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