[etni] Re: spik inglish

From: Rivka Lewenstein <rlewen@xxxxxxxxx>
To: etni@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Date: Tue, 23 Feb 2010 00:21:05 -0800 (PST)
I strongly disagree with the statement "it is impossible for non-native 
speakers to achieve full native competence." Obviously, most of our students 
will NOT achieve full native competence, and that's OK. But saying that no one 
will is a defeatist attitude. I know many people who have achieved that level 
of competence despite being non-native speakers with no English-speaking 
background to speak of. I even have students who come to Israel from Russia in 
9th or 10th grade who are almost at that level of competence (there are some 
fantastic English schools in Moscow), and who are likely to reach the level of 
native speaker if they continue their English studies for another few years. 
I'm not saying that we should expect all our students to reach that level - but 
saying that it's unrealistic and impossible is a defeatist attitude - and 
unfair to our students who CAN do more.
All the best,
Rivka

Doron wrote:

Another point in the "spik Inglish" wars: since it is impossible for 
non-native speakers to achieve full native competence, it is wrong to hold 
them to a native-speaker standard. We should talk, precisely, of 
"competence" in L1, L2, L3, etc., as indeed the European Union, among 
others, suggests. Laurie will never be mistaken for a native-speaking 
Bedouin; she can, with work, reach pretty good L3 competence, and be 
congratulated for doing so. The same is true of Barry's Russian and 
Ethiopian pupils, and my Arabic speakers - all hope to achieve "sufficiently 
good" competence in their L3 - English. To expect more is worse than 
unrealistic, it is unfair and disempowering.

Doron


      

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[etni] Re: spik inglish

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