[AR] Re: Subject: Re: NASA test of quantum vacuum plasma thruster (was "Anyone
- From: Jake Anderson <jake@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- To: arocket@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
- Date: Fri, 08 Aug 2014 17:31:58 +1000
On 08/08/14 16:04, John Schilling wrote:
Date: Fri, 08 Aug 2014 00:18:41 +1000
From: Jake Anderson<jake@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [AR] Re: NASA test of quantum vacuum plasma thruster (was
"Anyone
It is an "unbalanced force", in every case F = MA if something pushes in
one way it is balanced by something pushing in the other.
If the thruster worked, sure it took power in, but it produces a force
without pushing on something else and from there there are any number of
ways of turning that into perpetual motion.
I do still wonder where a photonic system fails and I'd really like to
hear an explanation for why it would, though I fear the answer involves
actual numbers not just abstract thought to work. ;->
Well, we can apply some abstract thinking to the concept of "work":
Work = Force x Distance. Power = Work / Time, and Speed = Distance /
Time,
thus Power = Force x Speed.
If you've got a gadget that produces force F, and you couple it to a
generator whose armature moves at speed S, then simplistically you ought
to be able to get power P = F x S out. If that's more than the power you
put in, there's a problem.
So, solve for S, i.e. Speed. For any supposed reactionless thruster,
there is a critical speed beyond which attaching that thruster to a
generator results in a perpetual motion machine. That speed is equal
to P/F.
For the best EMdrive allegedly tested in the paper, that speed is about
50 km/s. Practically irrelevant, but still theoretically troubling.
For the EMdrive allegedly predicted by theory and tested by the Chinese,
that speed is only 2.5 km/s. We can actually build flywheels that spin
that fast if we really need to. The Chinese are instead still building
coal-fired powerplants.
Actually they have stopped building coal power plants at least in a
decent hunk of the country.
They are getting on the green bandwagon, just as our country (Australia)
is getting off it, party politics is stupid.
(when china is being more "green" than you, you are doing it wrong)
For an ideal photon drive, P/F comes to exactly 299,792,458 m/s.
Sound familiar? Yep. A photon drive becomes a perpetual motion machine
the moment you attach it to a generator whose armature moves faster than
light, and no sooner.
Conservation of Momentum, Conservation of Energy, Special and General
Relativity, they've all got each other's back.
John Schilling
john.schilling@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
(661) 718-0955
That's the thing, the link I posted shows they are getting ~3000x the
efficiency of a photon drive because they bounce the photons back
between a pair of mirrors, which seems to be throwing a spanner into
those works.
Coming up with some spinning system that allows for the same bouncing
isn't really that hard.
So you get a speed of 3MMs / 3K = 100km/sec which is "exciting" but not
ruled out by physics and not enough for red shift to really be playing a
massive role?
or would it, hmm that might kill it off, each bounce the light makes
will red shift it just a little, after 3000 odd bounces it'll wind up
zeroed out.
That sound right to you?
oh well, it was a nice dream, I was going to be a nice dictator honest ;->
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