That is surely the point. An organisation which demands that other organisations give their customers information in their preferred format should do likewise without putting barriers in the way of those who ask for a particular format. Surely an organisation which claims that Braille is important should make instructions for products they sell readily available in Braille.
Iain-----Original Message----- From: Dave Sheridan
Sent: Thursday, January 22, 2015 2:12 PM To: access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Subject: [access-uk] Re: RNIB, how inefficient are they?The difference between the printed word in a book, on a tablet or a computer is minimal as the user is still reading. For a braille user reading involves either hard copy or a braille display, otherwise one would be listening. I'm not knocking you Karl, you make a choice in what's most effective for you. I do however have huge problems where an organisation supposedly looking to maintain the rights of blind and partially sighted people show such a poor attitude towards what is crucial for thousands of blind people's every day needs, namely braille.
Dave Sent from my iPhone
On 22 Jan 2015, at 13:48, Karl Proud <karl@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:I guess that some people do see the printed word as old tech, certainly the school my kids go to seem pretty obsessed with tablets etc. I'm afraid that I am one of those blind folk who do consider braille old fuddy duddy technology, but then again I'm wrong about most things.Karl On 22 Jan 2015, at 1:33 pm, Mike Ray <mike@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote: The RNIB now seems to be run by suits with little or no grasp of what the customers really need. In a world where everything is being dumbed-down to a lowest common denominator what we are now seeing is charity bosses who see little else than the bottom line. How they got to that bottom line is of little importance to them. Just making the expenditure smaller and the income bigger seems to be an end in itself now. And no doubt one of the things that is pared to the bone to make the bottom line look better is training for customer facing staff and expenditure on what is seen as old technology. And sadly Braille is perceived by sighted folks, and a lot of blind folks now too, as old tech. Although presumably sighted folks don't regard reading printed words as old tech.On 22/01/2015 13:16, Clive.Lever@xxxxxxxxxxx wrote: Hi Dave,Don't get me on my soap box about this one. Cynically, I sometimes wonder whether the more they can dissuade congenitally blind people from blocking their resources with loads of braille, the more they can concentrate on their pet subject: "sight loss". If they tell customers as a matter of course that braille copies will cost loads, take ages or generate boatloads of paper, they will get the answer they nudged their customer to give: "Ok then, I'll have an audio version". Then they will say: "more and more people are using audio and fewer are reading braille, so Braille's on its way out". Whooppee! They won't have to devote resources to it. Is there such a thing as "Lowp! (the opposite of hype), or of demoting rather than promoting a service? I encountered similar problems when I was asking for computer manuals as far back as 1982, so sadly, your tale leads me to think nothing has changed, except that the Institute sometimes appears to be suffering from sight loss itself.
.
.it's lost sight of the ball! I've usually found that a rough equation stands me in good stead: Two-and-a-half to three braille pages for every a4 side of dense print in a pretty standard font size. So, when I read the original was 96 pages, I thought "300's going to be nearer the mark. I read on, And surprise, surprise!Best, Clive -----Original Message-----From: access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Dave SheridanSent: 22 January 2015 12:37 To: access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Subject: [access-uk] RNIB, how inefficient are they?I recently received a Plextalk pocket portable daisy player as a present. The kind person who gave me this enquired about braille instructions and was told that they could do this but they would be about 600 pages. The person accepted that audio instructions would suffice. After receipt of said player I rang to ask for braille instructions and was told the same thing. I asked for the braille copy. Interestingly the audio contents goes up to page 96 so I was a little confused why this would translate to 600 braille pages. I've just received the instructions in 3 volumes totalling just under 300 A4 pages. Clearly those people providing potential customers with information should be well informed and clearly they are not:To add to this a friend of mine who took out a subscription to the talking book service has been perplexed by RNIB sending books which don't appear on the list she supplied them with. This has occurred twice now within a short period of time, firstly with books she hadn't ordered appearing on a pen drive sent to her and since then having changed to disc she has been sent other titles not ordered by her. Having experienced this myself over some considerable time before I was blunt with them I I do wonder why their customer service is so poor. As you have to ask for braille instructions these days you would think they would give good information and not try to put you off getting them to do the job they are there to do.Dave Sent from my iPhone** To leave the list, click on the immediately-following link:-** [mailto:access-uk-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx?subject=unsubscribe] ** If this link doesn't work then send a message to: ** access-uk-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx ** and in the Subject line type ** unsubscribe ** For other list commands such as vacation mode, click on the ** immediately-following link:- ** [mailto:access-uk-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx?subject=faq] ** or send a message, to ** access-uk-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with the Subject:- faq ** To leave the list, click on the immediately-following link:- ** [mailto:access-uk-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx?subject=unsubscribe] ** If this link doesn't work then send a message to: ** access-uk-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx ** and in the Subject line type ** unsubscribe ** For other list commands such as vacation mode, click on the ** immediately-following link:- ** [mailto:access-uk-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx?subject=faq] ** or send a message, to ** access-uk-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with the Subject:- faq-- Michael A. Ray Analyst/Programmer Witley, Surrey, South-east UK Don't judge my disability until you witness my ability Interested in accessibility on the Raspberry Pi? Visit: http://www.raspberryvi.org/ From where you can join our mailing list for visually-impaired Pi hackers ** To leave the list, click on the immediately-following link:- ** [mailto:access-uk-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx?subject=unsubscribe] ** If this link doesn't work then send a message to: ** access-uk-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx ** and in the Subject line type ** unsubscribe ** For other list commands such as vacation mode, click on the ** immediately-following link:- ** [mailto:access-uk-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx?subject=faq] ** or send a message, to ** access-uk-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with the Subject:- faq ** To leave the list, click on the immediately-following link:- ** [mailto:access-uk-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx?subject=unsubscribe] ** If this link doesn't work then send a message to: ** access-uk-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx ** and in the Subject line type ** unsubscribe ** For other list commands such as vacation mode, click on the ** immediately-following link:- ** [mailto:access-uk-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx?subject=faq] ** or send a message, to ** access-uk-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with the Subject:- faq
** To leave the list, click on the immediately-following link:- ** [mailto:access-uk-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx?subject=unsubscribe] ** If this link doesn't work then send a message to: ** access-uk-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx ** and in the Subject line type ** unsubscribe ** For other list commands such as vacation mode, click on the ** immediately-following link:- ** [mailto:access-uk-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx?subject=faq] ** or send a message, to** access-uk-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with the Subject:- faq
** To leave the list, click on the immediately-following link:- ** [mailto:access-uk-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx?subject=unsubscribe] ** If this link doesn't work then send a message to: ** access-uk-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx ** and in the Subject line type ** unsubscribe ** For other list commands such as vacation mode, click on the ** immediately-following link:- ** [mailto:access-uk-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx?subject=faq] ** or send a message, to ** access-uk-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with the Subject:- faq