[AR] Re: Catching Oumuamua

  • From: Rand Simberg <simberg@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
  • To: arocket@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
  • Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2021 17:12:12 -0800

Yes, in this case, the UK government. Since they are making RTGs, I don't know any reason that they wouldn't be amenable to selling them.

On 3/1/21 4:45 PM, William Claybaugh wrote:

Mike:

Am 241 is a special nuclear material; if one has  to use an RTG, one has to deal with a government.

Bill

On Mon, Mar 1, 2021 at 5:04 PM Michael Kelly <dmarc-noreply@xxxxxxxxxxxxx <mailto:dmarc-noreply@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>> wrote:

    Northrop Grumman makes a whole range of pulse-tube cryocoolers for
    space applications, and have been developing them as electric
    generators when run in reverse.  They have no moving parts (well,
    no parts that move very far), and last forever.
    https://rps.nasa.gov/internal_resources/160/
    <https://rps.nasa.gov/internal_resources/160/>

    And, yes, Americium 241 is back in production (big time).  It
    would provide a more level power output in RTG applications, given
    a half-life ~> 5 times that of Pu 238.

    On March 1, 2021 at 10:47 AM, William Claybaugh
    <wclaybaugh2@xxxxxxxxx <mailto:wclaybaugh2@xxxxxxxxx>> wrote:

    Rand:

    Yep, but that does not justify ignoring the best answers.

    Bill

    On Mon, Mar 1, 2021 at 8:24 AM Rand Simberg
    <simberg@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx <mailto:simberg@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>> wrote:

        Bill, you're the one who started this topic as a "home-built
        space mission."

        On 3/1/21 7:18 AM, William Claybaugh wrote:
        Rand:

        They don't last as long and NASA Gleen's Stirling power
        systems are (ground) qualified for 20 years.

        Bill

        On Mon, Mar 1, 2021 at 8:02 AM Rand Simberg
        <simberg@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx <mailto:simberg@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>>
        wrote:

            You could buy one from the UK. They've started making
            them out of Americium.

            On 3/1/21 6:55 AM, William Claybaugh wrote:
            Rand:

            I think an efficient RTG is required and that will mean
            USG involvement in what likely wants to otherwise be a
            privately funded activity.

            Bill

            On Mon, Mar 1, 2021 at 7:47 AM Rand Simberg
            <simberg@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
            <mailto:simberg@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>> wrote:

                That begs the question of why it would be either
                big budget, or done by
                NASA. :-)

                On 2/28/21 10:00 PM, Henry Spencer wrote:
                > On Sat, 27 Feb 2021, Robert Steinke wrote:
                >>       imparting about... 15km/s if the back of
                my envelope is
                >>       correct. That's a whole lot for a chemical
                rocket...
                >>
                >> That close to the sun it should be easier to do
                high thrust solar
                >> thermal.
                >> Wikipedia says Isp up to 1000 seconds so the
                mass ratio would need to be
                >> ~4.5.  Use a drop tank for boiloff so the burn
                starts out with a full
                >> tank.
                >
                > Unfortunately, that Isp requires LH2, and after
                circa a decade in
                > space (out to Jupiter and back), almost certainly
                it will all be gone.
                >
                > There are ways of storing LH2 for years, in
                principle, e.g. active
                > refrigeration, but it's beyond today's state of
                the art, and I believe
                > Bill is hoping for a relatively low-cost mission.
                >
                > (A big-budget planetary mission isn't going
                anywhere unless you can
                > convince a Decadal Review to make it their first
                priority, which isn't
                > going to happen for this.  Smaller efforts can
                sometimes do end runs
                > around the traditional process, but ill-defined
                costs and risks from
                > techological pioneering are just what you don't
                want if you're trying
                > to convince people to stick their necks out in
                support.)
                >
                > Henry






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