On 12/02/2015 07:44 PM, Ben Brockert wrote:
How many times have you smelled fluorine, and are your nosehairs nowI got a nose full of high-conc formic once. Kicks like a mule. I don't remember the exact chemical reason for futzing with the stuff, only
fully nonstick and passivated for oxidizer service?
On Wed, Dec 2, 2015 at 7:29 PM, Anthony Cesaroni <acesaroni@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
Similar to ammonia. More like fluorine IMO if you are a true connoisseur.
Anthony
Sent from my iPhone
On Dec 2, 2015, at 6:33 PM, John Dom <johndom@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
The name Louwers is familiar dating from his amateur rocketeer days. I doubt I
ever met him in The Netherlands. Bottled aqueous hydrazine N2H4 solution smells
like ammonia.
jd
-----Original Message-----
From: arocket-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:arocket-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On
Behalf Of Anthony Cesaroni
Sent: woensdag 2 december 2015 17:11
To: arocket@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [AR] Re: HNF issues
That would be http://www.appbv.nl/index.asp
Our director of propulsion worked there before joining our company. He did his
thesis on the combustion of HNF and it makes a fine coffee table book.
The issue with HNF tends to be compatibility with many traditional propellant
constituents as well as elevated temperatures above 60 C. We solved many of the
compatibility issues by coating the HNF with functional nitrocellulose then
cross-linking it in situ. This also greatly improves the mechanical properties
of the finished propellant.
HNF is produced by an exothermic crystallization reaction of hydrazine and
trinitromethane, often in the presence of ultrasound. When it decomposes, it releases
hydrazine and as strange as it sounds, it's very incompatible with hydrazine so it
"runs away". Slowly or quickly depending on the conditions. That's how I found
out what hydrazine smells like. :-). Conversely, Dr. Louwers analyzed some neat HNF that
had been stored in a unconditioned magazine at China Lake for over 30 years and it was
perfectly fine. The other challenge is it's very high burn rate exponent but there are
ways to deal with that too.
It's also incredibly expensive ($8000~$10,000 kg. depending on the grade) but
large scale production would reduce the costs enough to justify the performance
advantages.
Aside from that, its fine.
Anthony J. Cesaroni
President/CEO
Cesaroni Technology/Cesaroni Aerospace
http://www.cesaronitech.com/
(941) 360-3100 x101 Sarasota
(905) 887-2370 x222 Toronto
-----Original Message-----
From: arocket-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:arocket-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On
Behalf Of John Dom
Sent: Wednesday, December 02, 2015 9:28 AM
To: arocket@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [AR] HNF issues
On Behalf Of Anthony Cesaroni 12022015
Describes Hydrazinium Nitroforomate (HNF) perfectly... Unfortunately it likeIssues like?
other magic propellants, has issues.
(I remember a factory was built to produce HNF in the Netherlands, close to our
border. Gas generators for ESA I guess. I did not follow this up further).
jd